Marco of Lombardy, the angry penitent, continues his diagnosis of the world's problems. It's got only one sun, not two, as Rome had. And that one sun, the papacy, is not kosher. In fact, perhaps cannot be kosher under any circumstances.

Join me, Mark Scarbrough, as we explore a big chunk of Marco's reasoning about the world's ills. He said it was in us. But he seems to claim it's far more systemic than personal.

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Here are the segments of this episode of WALKING WITH DANTE:

[01:45] My English translation of the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XVI, lines 97 - 129. If you'd like to read along or continue the conversation with me, just scroll down this page.

[04:29] The papacy is not--or cannot be--kosher.

[07:36] Pastoral metaphoric space unifies the passage.

[09:30] Our nature is NOT corrupted?

[12:46] The papacy v. the empire: Dante's dilemma.

[18:26] The papacy v. the empire: the dilemma of Dante's age.

[21:17] Marco's argument moves back into personal space: his own Lombardy.

[22:48] Three good men are left on the Italian peninsula.

[26:10] These three good men are in contrast to the gluten Ciacco's two witnesses in INFERNO, Canto VI.

[29:36] The church of Rome isn't in Rome anymore!

[31:44] Rereading the passage: PURGATORIO, Canto XVI, lines 97 - 129.

And here’s my English translation of PURGATORIO, Canto XVI, Lines 97 – 129

“The laws exist, but who has them in hand?

No one! Because the shepherd in charge

May be a ruminant but has no cloven hooves.

 

“That’s why the people, who see their leader

Grab the very things for which they themselves are greedy,

Graze on that and call out for nothing more.

 

“You can readily see that poor leadership

Is the reason the world has become rotten.

It’s not that the nature in all of you has been corrupted.

 

“Take Rome, for example, which once modeled the world for good.

It had two suns. Each made visible one road and then

The other—that is, [the road] to the world and [the road] to God.

 

“One has extinguished the other. Now the sword is

Fused with the crook. Roughly forced together, the one with the other

Can only manage to make things go bad.

 

“For being together, neither one fears the other.

If you don’t believe me, consider the grain,

For every plant is known by its seed.

 

“In the fields watered by the Adige and the Po,

Valor and courtesy were once found,

Before Frederick met his opposition.

 

“Now that land can be safely traversed

By anyone who out of shame

Wants to avoid speaking with good persons or even getting near them.

 

“Well, there are still three good men in whom

The ancient age rebukes the new one. They are barely holding on

Until God takes them to a better life.

 

“Currado del Palazzo and the good Gherardo

And Guido da Castello, who is better called

‘The honest Lombard’ by the French.

 

“From now on, declare that the church of Rome,

By compounding in herself the one who governs,

Falls into the muck, dirtying herself and her burdens.”